Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Oct 31, 2017 9:33:04 GMT
There’s this very clever Dutch company called ‘Triton’ who produce this xlr adapter type plug, which you plug into the bottom of your mic and get a massive gain boost with way less noise from the mic.
I’ve just received one and been trying it out. It plugs directly beneath your mic and then you plug the cable into it. Switch on 48v phantom power and suddenly, your dynamic microphone becomes a sensitive very low noise device. I couldn’t believe how good it was. In fact, a dynamic seems to gain the liveliness of a condenser mic.
Sensitivity is crazy. I could hear the noise of water running through the central heating pipes before the noise floor became anything like obtrusive. In fact, room noise is greater than the noise floor of the mic.
I have a couple of cheap xm8500 Mics that retail at all of £18 each and they sound amazing. Shure sm58 kicks off as well.
Because the gain of the microphone becomes so high (20db higher is claimed), then you can turn the preamp gain right down. This instantly lowers the preamp noise floor to insignificance.
There is also another version for condenser Mics that passes the 48v through to power the mic as well. I may well get one of those as well I think since it stops you having to lay out big money for lower noise Mics. I have found that for quite a lot more money, you get small reductions of noise.
Saves a lot of money in the long run. Clever people over there. They’ve really sussed it.
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Post by drumdrym on Nov 7, 2017 11:39:22 GMT
Hi Ian, picked up this for me, interesting link, ........................................................... www.rane.com/note148.htmlAlan
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 7, 2017 22:24:13 GMT
Thanks Alan. It is indeed a minefield. Like headphones, even the specs seem to be all over the place. Just been trying out a condenser mic with a supposed noise floor that is 2db lower than the at2020.Via all of my preamps, it’s audibly louder.
The other thing is that the noise itself might be higher or lower in pitch and so some pitches are more noticeable to the ears than others.
With all cheaper Mics, I’m getting the same kinds of problems.... noise floor. I have used some much better Mics and actually, they can make you lazy about setting gains and placement since they work so quietly, but the cheaper stuff just doesn’t get there for me. AT 2020 only just about and even then, it’s a borderline mic for me.
I don’t know whether you know about the Audible ‘standards’ for audio. That’s what I’m having to try to reach for this filming. That means a noise floor with minimum of -60db but also an rms of 22db. It’s actually a juggling match if you haven’t got a clean take to get the noise floor down and the average volume up. I have to put every clip through a tester to see whether the standards of audio are close. What really annoys me is that compression gives a much louder signal but it also raises the noise floor, so you can reach the rms value, but then you’ve exceeded the noise lfloor. So you then meet the noise floor only to find that the rms isn’t loud enough!!!! Luckily, I’m being treated well and the standards aren’t being forced onto me but that’s what is wanted. Audible insist on it for their material.
For film stuff, it’s not quite as critical until you come to quiet room interviews. Same for audio books but at least you can get the mic really close to push the s/n ratio down. So a cheaper mic is fine if you’re on top of it. With video, you don’t always have the luxury of being able to put the mic under the actor’s face so that brings problems in quiet rooms especially.
The xm8500 is remarkably quiet in comparison to the condensers. Just wire and magnets. No electronics going on in there like a condenser. For speech, I really like the 8500 but it does need a lot of gain so noise can be introduced via the preamp if you’re not careful. That’s where I found the triton helps a lot and it opens up the xm8500 to a lot of things for me.
For instance, I have two Saramonic battery preamps. One takes a single xlr mic and the other is the plus, so it takes two mics, either xlr or mini jack. That means I can place two xm8500 in different places and control them from the Smartrig plus with a ton of gain using the triton.
The dynamics tend to not have as wide a FR as the condensers, but they really do suit voice well and I’m getting great results. The beauty of the xm8500 is their cheapness, so I don’t worry about setting them up in a hall and leaving them in situ. I have placed 3 hanging from a stage, facing down and I can lower them for recording with very little impact on the audience. I’m taking the band with an AT2020 (in mono) and taking voices from one of the three dangling Mics all heavily preamped. Don’t need stereo for this project.
Started the job now so I’ve got into the habit of recording ten seconds of absolute silence for cleanup but as you are well aware, the cleaner the feed, the easier the cleanup.
I’m glad that I had a serious play around with the gear before starting because there are so many variables. I’ve been mostly testing at very low levels but for most of the stuff I’m doing, levels are reduced because there’s a lot more noise so mic noise becomes less of an issue.
I think the only real answer might be to get a decent one, but I don’t fancy mixing a good mic with loads of cheapies. The differences might show up too much so really, I need a set from Santa.
XM8500 has been a real surprise to me. Just a touch of EQ in the treble and they’re great. Can’t do the EQ with a Saramonic, so I fix it later. Saramonic aren’t too bad. A bit noisy but they do work.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 9, 2017 12:31:21 GMT
Fethead into Saramonic gives insane amount of gain with dynamics. Way too much, but at least it’s nice to know that I can get even a dynamic microphone to receive audio from a long way off, although the inherent noise due to gain would have to go through serious cleanup as well. It’s possible though. Once you get a noise sample.
Another mic that I’m finding extremely good with vocal is the AKG D5. Similar 8n sensitivity to the xm8500 but just a little edge in the treble that makes the xm8500 ‘seem’ cloudier by comparison in the bass. The AKG, just like their headphones adds a bit more treble bite with the bass dropping away from 70hz which is really quite nice for the voice.
If you get a strong baritone like voice, I noticed this week that the xm8500 is quick to pick it out and I ended up with an EQ job. Changed to a D5 and there was a lot less to do due to the fact that the D5 is slightly more ‘squeaky’.
The Triton dynamic preamp is really showing it’s worth in real use. Way lower noise than the mics themselves and it’s nice to know that I can actually bump the gain up if needed. It sure makes all dynamics a lot more lively. Pity that no mic has this kind of thing built in .... oh maybe that’s the condenser? Although they do need 48v phantom and have a wider response, they aren’t really so good at the bottom end of the market where dynamics are quite a bit quieter since no electronics are needed.
Ok was going to do some voiceovers with the AT2020, but I think I might use the D5 tbh. Not so Hi-Fi sounding and seems more natural to me with a touch of reverb added to smooth it out. It’s also has a super cardiod polar pattern so noise rejection is really good. I was recording with the xm8500 when the doorbell went. The xm8500 managed to hear it. Doing the same with the D5 and getting my daughter to press the bell, the D5 rejected it nicely due to its pickup.
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