Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Apr 12, 2017 8:48:42 GMT
For me, Deep Purple has always been a bit hit and miss. I'm not sure why. Possibly because it's a kind of 'American rock' sound or perhaps because the sound tends to be mostly the whole band going at it with less daylight in between. They play really well together though and there's no denying that. I certainly liked Jon Lord a great deal and in my early years, even had masterclasses with him. He was a serious guy with a very much wider outlook than just Deep Purple as a band. He was one of my favourite players along with Keith Emerson. In fact, he even wrote a series of rock exercise pieces for keyboard which were really lovely to play. This new album from Deep Purple (without Jon) retains a touch of that earlier rock sound but to me it sounds like a more mature band. The keyboard player uses some different sounds at places as well as that 'Jon Lord' organ sound but there seems to be more variation of things going on amongst the songs, which is way more interesting for me. Some good riffs going on too; slightly reminiscent of Uriah Heep. Another band that I really like. So for me, this is a more interesting listen and one that I'll listen to a lot I think, along with the famous earlier album with the statues on the front sleeve and the concerto. Worth a listen. Amazon
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Javier
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Post by Javier on Apr 12, 2017 9:31:47 GMT
Without Blackmore and Lord I can't really consider the current line up as Deep Purple. I didn't even like the Coverdale era TBH. That doesn't mean I think they aren't any good just not proper Purple. Horses for courses. Forgot to mention I haven't listened to this album yet.
Sent from my GT-I9505 using proboards
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Apr 12, 2017 13:29:40 GMT
The copy I have is really compressed Javier. No dynamic content to speak of. All loud. I listened and then had a look at the files. They're almost flat as a pancake all through the album. Great pity since there is no real contrast going on with regards to volume.
Might be better lot look for a better source.
This has a 'flavour' of the Purple sound but is also different to the earlier albums. It is quite 'Americanised' sounding to me with a blues feel in places along with riffs.
I just wish the dynamic range was better because this sounds like a dab radio mix to me. I feel like the engineering leaves a lot to be desired.
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Javier
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Post by Javier on Apr 12, 2017 14:35:35 GMT
Not surprising you find it flat....
foobar2000 1.2.9 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1 log date: 2017-04-06
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Analyzed: Deep Purple / Infinite --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR Peak RMS Duration Track -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- DR7 0.00 dB -8.28 dB 4:35 01-Time for Bedlam DR6 0.00 dB -7.08 dB 3:23 02-Hip Boots DR7 0.00 dB -7.74 dB 4:42 03-All I Got is You DR7 0.00 dB -7.49 dB 3:24 04-One Night in Vegas DR6 0.00 dB -7.43 dB 3:59 05-Get Me Outta Here DR7 0.00 dB -9.36 dB 5:58 06-The Surprising DR7 0.00 dB -8.78 dB 3:51 07-Johnny's Band DR7 0.00 dB -9.20 dB 4:02 08-On Top of the World DR6 0.00 dB -7.84 dB 5:48 09-Birds of Prey DR7 0.00 dB -8.18 dB 6:01 10-Roadhouse Blues --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Number of tracks: 10 Official DR value: DR7
Samplerate: 44100 Hz Channels: 2 Bits per sample: 16 Bitrate: 1000 kbps Codec: FLAC ================================================================================
I'll have a listen tonight though sonically I don't hold any high expectations hopefully it'll be better artistically
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Apr 12, 2017 15:57:49 GMT
Yes, I took a look after listening to the shape of the files. No peaks at all. Absolute brick wall. Great pity because for me, it takes away from the music tbh. There's no real light and shade in the sound for the whole album.
Some of the songs are a little unusual too.
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Post by ronzo56 on Apr 12, 2017 18:28:17 GMT
Why all the compression? This loudness war is completely out of control. I was thinking of downloading David Bowie's last album Blackstar from HDTracks. Luckily I decided to look it up on the Dynamic Range Database. DR-5! DR max is a 6! Soon albums will be a 1. What a shame. The CD is the same as the 24/96 files. Interestingly the vinyl is a DR-11. ??
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Apr 12, 2017 18:38:03 GMT
It's a great pity. It sucks the life out of the music. With Deep Purple, I think that it really works against their sound since a great deal of it is the whole band playing a very solid texture. Compressing it just makes it sound even thicker with no 'space' to allow the listener to hear inside. Kind of like being on one side of a wall!!
This album just has a few unusual things in it that perk up the interest. Bowie' album was 'spooky'. But as you say, once again, compression sucks the life away from it.
I guess most people listen on crappy gear so they don't mind it. The louder, the better for them?
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Post by ronzo56 on Apr 12, 2017 19:06:54 GMT
Fortunately I can stream it on Amazon Music for free. With all the compression I'm guessing you can't hear any difference between formats. Would love to hear the vinyl. Yes, a spooky album. But really very creative. He was an amazing talent.
A friend of mine just got into digital hi-res and was excited to see Elton John's Goodbye Yellowbrick Road on HDTracks. Then we looked it up. Compressed from a 13 on the CD to a 9. I've had him listen to albums that I have on CD and then the "new and improved" remastered and overly compressed release. He hated the remaster. Every time. So he passed on HDTracks and found a 1984 CD. Cheaper and way better sound. Unfortunately they seem to have compressed most of Elton's early albums for SACD and hi-rez. I have Madman Across the Water on SACD. I can't make it all the way through before I put the original CD on. Just kills the wonderful air of the original.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Apr 12, 2017 21:16:47 GMT
I can also stream from Amazon Ron and that's where I heard the Deep Purple album. Normally, I don't get hung up with formats etc. The music is more important to me, but with this one, it actually detracts from the sound of the album imo. I'd heard about the Elton John remastering being compressed a bit more. Maybe they were trying to get it to be a better match with modern recordings for the radio? Try to reissue it via broadcast perhaps. I must admit to being a bit skeptic all about hi res copies since so much fiddling around seems to go on. The first DSD files I heard were very impressive and the first thing that I noticed was the wider dynamic range, Javier did some checking when I mentioned it to him and indeed,he did find that the dynamic range was slightly better than other copies on the files that I was listening to. To me, the dynamic range is very important to the life of the music and too much compression just makes it sound like it's coming from a transistor radio!! (Although a good transistor radio!!!)
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jello
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Post by jello on Apr 12, 2017 21:52:57 GMT
I gave this a listen on Tidal earlier. First track is very good (naff voiceover aside) and you had me confused with the 'American rock' reference Ian. Sounds like classic British metal to me, perhaps with a Germanic flavour due to the slightly operatic vibe and fancy guitar work. A couple of seconds into track #2 and I can see what you were getting at Some tracks better than others and that Roadhouse Blues cover is not great at all. Sailing into pub rock seas with that one. But by golly despite some very good musicianship it sounds flat as a pancake and very closed in. I'm back listening to IEMs finally (I won't say the T****** or that I received them within a day of ordering to avoid distress to the innocent...) and assumed it was them not being overly dynamic but nope going to my home set up and it wasn't any better. Such a shame as it really kills things. I can understand the concept of limiting DR so that things sound good aka loud on the radio, but seriously how much airplay is this even likely to get? And who is going to be buying it other than their diehard fans...who would buy it regardless of whether it was good or bad Makes you wonder.
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Post by tupisac on Apr 12, 2017 23:41:52 GMT
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cj
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Post by cj on Apr 13, 2017 1:10:43 GMT
Even as a Deep Purple fan I'll agree with Ian that their output is patchy. I did like their previous outing thinking it was one of their best for some time, even without JL.
I haven't heard this one yet but am disappointed that it has been brickwalled to death. I have several favourite albums that I'm unable to play on a decent audio system because the compression leaves then sounding awful. Straight off the phone or bluetoothed to the car stereo is the limit.
Next chance I get I'll give DPs latest a go although I don't think Roadhouse Blues should have made it to the final line up. Do we really need another half baked version of this?
With some compression suffering albums you can make them a little more listenable by using programmes that attempt to "replace" ( probably just an algorithm based formula to make an educated guess) the missing dynamic range. One is SeeDaClip, I use Diamond Forensics. The track needs to be normalised afterwards, again I use DF but another is SoundForge. On less effected tracks this can be pleasing but truly brickwalled tracks either don't benefit or actually get worse.
I've only seen DP live once. In the rain at Knebworth in'85. 32 years ago!!! Good god.
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Post by ronzo56 on Apr 13, 2017 2:54:49 GMT
I can also stream from Amazon Ron and that's where I heard the Deep Purple album. Normally, I don't get hung up with formats etc. The music is more important to me, but with this one, it actually detracts from the sound of the album imo. I'd heard about the Elton John remastering being compressed a bit more. Maybe they were trying to get it to be a better match with modern recordings for the radio? Try to reissue it via broadcast perhaps. I must admit to being a bit skeptic all about hi res copies since so much fiddling around seems to go on. The first DSD files I heard were very impressive and the first thing that I noticed was the wider dynamic range, Javier did some checking when I mentioned it to him and indeed,he did find that the dynamic range was slightly better than other copies on the files that I was listening to. To me, the dynamic range is very important to the life of the music and too much compression just makes it sound like it's coming from a transistor radio!! (Although a good transistor radio!!!) The increased dynamic range on the first hi-rez SACD's I bought is what sold me on the format. Then the compression started. Kind of defeats the whole point. Luckily not all files are being compressed. But too many well recorded albums are being ruined. For what? So they sound good in the car? I predict in a few years they will make more money by re-issuing these albums with no compression as another marketing scheme.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Apr 13, 2017 7:12:51 GMT
Never thought of that, Ron. Very odd strategy though. Sell a duff version so hi res goes later!!
The wave form is one of the flattest I've seen. Variation between loud and soft is minimum, No peaks at all and what I don't get is why they'd do this with a band that mostly plays as a "brick wall sound' unit a lot of the time. I think that's one of the reasons why I've often found them difficult to get on with perhaps.
I might try one if those 'decompress' programmes, Chris. Even electronically trying to improve it might help this album. Turn it down and it sounds kind of inconsequential and turn it up for a solid wall of sound. It was so bad, that it had me going through other albums in order to check that my gear is OK!!
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Crispy
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Post by Crispy on Apr 14, 2017 19:28:12 GMT
Not surprising you find it flat.... foobar2000 1.2.9 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1 log date: 2017-04-06 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Analyzed: Deep Purple / Infinite -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- DR Peak RMS Duration Track -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- DR7 0.00 dB -8.28 dB 4:35 01-Time for Bedlam DR6 0.00 dB -7.08 dB 3:23 02-Hip Boots DR7 0.00 dB -7.74 dB 4:42 03-All I Got is You DR7 0.00 dB -7.49 dB 3:24 04-One Night in Vegas DR6 0.00 dB -7.43 dB 3:59 05-Get Me Outta Here DR7 0.00 dB -9.36 dB 5:58 06-The Surprising DR7 0.00 dB -8.78 dB 3:51 07-Johnny's Band DR7 0.00 dB -9.20 dB 4:02 08-On Top of the World DR6 0.00 dB -7.84 dB 5:48 09-Birds of Prey DR7 0.00 dB -8.18 dB 6:01 10-Roadhouse Blues -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Number of tracks: 10 Official DR value: DR7 Samplerate: 44100 Hz Channels: 2 Bits per sample: 16 Bitrate: 1000 kbps Codec: FLAC ================================================================================ I'll have a listen tonight though sonically I don't hold any high expectations hopefully it'll be better artistically I have'nt found the time to listen to the album yet Javier, but I will do tomoro in the car? MP3 version I managed to get a copy from sources that cannot be named but my Flac versions come out different to yours, but whether they are better or not I don't really know?
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