Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on May 30, 2013 15:14:30 GMT
I've never been too keen on the sound sig of the DT880. I've always found it a bit light in the bass with something audible in the top that I really didn't like. (Possibly the ringing shown in the graphs below) I had a look and a listen to the DT990 today and find it to sound like a different headphone altogether and often wonder whether the DT990 should have been the flagship and not the 880. However, looking at the GE frequency charts for them both reveals a surprise: DT880 DT990 Both have that large 10KHz peak and yet, I'm not aware of it on the DT990. (Although I do feel that it has a raised top and bottom end) The biggest difference seems to be in the bass region and to me, it looks like they have the same drivers. I don't mind the DT990 at all and can happily listen for a long time on it and yet after 20 minutes or so with a DT880, I just want to take them off and crave more bass. Very odd. DT990 - £120 DT880 - £199 Something's not quite right here. DT990 is a bargain. Frans, I'm going to see if you do a 10KHz filter for this!!! Aha .... there IS one!!!!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2013 16:34:50 GMT
Completely agree Ian. I bought my 990/250's after reading the discussion you and Israel had (on RG) when he re-cabled his. I know they're far from 'accurate', but sometimes, with some sorts of music, I don't want accurate, I want exciting.I love the slightly raised top end, and the great slam you get. They are so comfy and although I try to be gentle with my phones, I get the impression they could take a bit of abuse without just falling apart. I generally don't like curly cables but the one on the 990's is not too tight and not too heavy. The only other Beyers I've heard are the 150's, another headphone Ian and Mike put me onto which I love - I'm using them with DT100 velours now which reduces slightly but tightens up the amazing bass. I'd like to get a listen to the 250's. I like the way Beyer make their headphones, they seem quite solid and I like the idea of the individual parts all being available to buy.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on May 30, 2013 17:28:58 GMT
Yes, well the Beyers are used quite extensively in all kinds of areas from music to film. The DT100's are a favourite with cameramen. They use a talkback attachment on them. I remember talking about my 'sit' test and how the Beyers can take my weight. I have this awful habit of taking them off and placing them on a chair I'm getting up from and then later, come back and ..... splat. They are tough. DT150 is a monster headphone. TBH, better eq'd. The 990 is a lovely headphone - as you say, plush and tough at the same time. It is exactly that - an entertaining listen. Funnily enough, it reminds me of the Portapro in sound!! Great for those occasions when you want a hefty bass line but not lose sight of the treble like some bass heavy cans do. Many headphones with a strong bass allow the bass to climb over everything else but the Beyers keep the treble in there. The DT880 is a different thing altogether though. It just doesn't have enough warmth for me and that 10KHz hump is actually annoying to me. Both the DT990 and DT880 are ringing nicely there. It looks to me as though the drivers are the same and yet the UK price of the DT880 is (to me) too high for what you get. I remember this sarcastic fanboy a few years ago, on Headfi. He bought the then fairly new DT880. I had one and when I dared to mention that I had a problem with the top end, he got all nasty with me. It got to the point where he was telling me just how neutral they are and I said that I didn't think so. (He was using a portable amp as well - one of Norm's Go Vibes!!!!!) In an attempt to be smart, he described the white screen of his computer as being white, just like the sound of the DT880. I told him my screen had a poofy pink hue like him. He went mad at me but I got some lovely reactions from other headfiers who told me he got on their nerves!!! The days when I was quite naughty on line. For £120 though, the DT990 is one headphone worth keeping imo. Actually, I had two but just sold one so I revisited my other one. I tend to buy two of some things so I can leave one at work!! My DT990 has lovely black velour pads and it looks a lot better than those grey ones. For some reason, they feel slightly fuller too so the drivers are slightly further back. (or mine are newer) My Senn HD600 and HD650 pads seem to flatten if you sneeze on them and they are so damned expensive to replace. I wish there was an alternative to the Senn ones, which are a little firmer. DT990 is amongst my favourite headphones. I'd say HD600 K601 DT990 T40/50 All lovely headphones in some ways and not too expensive except for HD600. Closed headphones (except T40) are another matter though. I have big problems with closed ones. Can't find one I could really settle with. K550 is good (with serious treble flaws imo) DT770 is good but fat one note type bass. DT1350 is ok but still for me has an odd mid response. (nasal) HD25 is a head and ear crusher. The only one I can tolerate for long listening at home is the AT a900 in spite of its thinness and lack of extension in the bass. It is at least 'pleasant. (ish)
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solderdude
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Post by solderdude on Jun 1, 2013 8:48:13 GMT
There are quite a few 'versions' of the DT770 and DT990 as well as the DT880. Especially the DT770 has quite a few of them ranging from reasonably 'flat' to right out bloating/boomy. The DT880 versions only differ mildly (considerable to some) but in general sound quite similar. The DT990 has changed over the years and various versions exist that are sonically different. I owned the DT990/600. It sounded very nice and the aspect I liked most was the 'musicality' and the fact that it makes most recordings sound 'nice'. For instance recordings that sound boring and flat on a DT880 sound 'full' on a DT990. The newer versions sound better IMO as do the Pro versions which seem to be the most desirable. Heard the Pro quite a few times. The DT880 I owned was the 2005 edition. Of all the DT880's the 600 Ohm version. If I were to buy one again would go for the DT880/600 as it is less 'edgy' than the other ones. Because a 'dip' is less annoying as a 'peak' the 600 Ohm version is sounding less 'edgy' Liked it very much for Jazz but not so much for a lot of other music I also prefer to listen to so sold it after a while. The DT770 comes in so many versions that all sound quite different that it is hard to compare them. The DT770 Pro/ 250 seems to be the 'flattest' one but also has the large peak in the highs. The DT770 person A owns/reviews may have completely different sonic properties as the one you or someone else owns so be careful when reading opinions/reviews. I owned the 'hifi' version of it (don't remember it's impedance) and found this one to have a 'one note' and bloating bass and the treble seemed more piercing than the DT880 and DT990 I had. Tried to tame the bass with damping materials and used a filter for the highs but could not get along with it for several reasons... sold it. I like the comfort and looks of the Beyers. For those that own one of them and need to change pads a slight warning, Even though mechanically the pads are interchangeable and even look similar there is a big (sonic) difference between the DT770 and DT990/DT990 pads. The differences are shown in my T40RP-mkII with DT770 pads article found here: diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/schematics/headphone/(scroll down a bit) The DT990 is the only one that stayed. I need to try to fix one driver yet again as it is intermittent again (not the wiring or plug but the driver itself)
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Jun 1, 2013 9:03:30 GMT
The DT990 that I have is the 250 ohm pro version. I quite like it. Very entertaining and as you say Frans, a musical sound rather than clinical.
Tough as old boots and very comfortable to wear.
I found out about the pads accidentally. I changed the DT 770 pads unwittingly for DR990 ones. Result was absolutely NO bass!
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solderdude
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Post by solderdude on Jun 1, 2013 9:13:11 GMT
It is alarming to see how much sonic differences exist between 2 (very similar looking) pads.
The weird thing is that the DT770 doesn't start to sound like an DT880 (or DT990, which share the same pads). It just becomes bass-less and because of the lack of bass appears to become 'screechy' as well.
The DT990 shares the 'makes most music sound good' trait a bit with a filtered HD681 although these do not sound that similar as a whole.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Jun 1, 2013 10:04:27 GMT
the lack of bass appears to become 'screechy' as well. It was so like a transistor radio with a 2 inch speaker that I thought someone had left one on somewhere!! Dreadful sound. I really couldn't believe it. I only changed the pads because I had black ones and they looked so dmned good on the DT770. (as they do on the DT990) I don't like the grey.
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dicky
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Post by dicky on Jun 4, 2013 7:12:39 GMT
I know they're far from 'accurate', but sometimes, with some sorts of music, I don't want accurate, I want exciting.I love the slightly raised top end, and the great slam you get. . While I totally agree here, I couldn't help noticing just how confused they seem compared to the T50s. I've been using my 990s for about a week - listening to some incremental mods I've been doing to an EQ. They certainly get your toes tapping; but returning to the T50s for some 'serious' listening revealed that the 990s seemed less realistic. However, this does depend on what you're listening to (horses for courses - as we all know). The 990s are more 'forgiving', and, while they have bass slam, it seems to lack attack compared to the T50s. With the T50s it's well defined - focussed. The 900s are more brute-force. My tuppence ha'penny.
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solderdude
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Post by solderdude on Jun 4, 2013 7:58:55 GMT
The funny thing with most headphones is deficiencies only start to become obvious or show themselves when comparing to a 'reference' headphone. When listening to a single headphone for some time I think the brain gets used to the presentation and is able to recreate 'accurate' sound from what enters the ear canal.
Had the same with the CAL... liked it stand-alone and sounded nice but on direct comparison it is colored as hell. Nice coloration but not accurate non the less.
I find it is easier and more relaxing to listen to 'accurate' headphones. It takes less effort.
For instance I really like the Koss thingies and think they are awesome when using them but as soon as you have put some better ones on your head and revert to the Koss thingies you immediatly notice where the Koss thingies are 'off' and sound relatively crappy. Yet... the next day you put the Koss thingies and they sound wonderfull again.
The DT990 is similar in this aspect. Sounds great but compared to better ones they show their 'faults'.
I find myself only grabbing the KSC75 at work, the DT1350+filter amp on the go and the Fostexes behind the PC and one in the livingroom. The rest hardly comes out of their bags nowadays.
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dicky
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Post by dicky on Jun 4, 2013 8:08:43 GMT
I find it is easier and more relaxing to listen to 'accurate' headphones. It takes less effort. Indeed, but some recordings just need some help. You just can't listen to them for too long!
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solderdude
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Post by solderdude on Jun 4, 2013 8:15:48 GMT
Yes... recording quality is more evident/paramount on the better headphones and bad recordings sound... well... bad. This did make me not playing certain albums anymore but increased listening pleasure with good recordings.
The Beyer DT990 is more 'forgiving' and not so well recorded material may sound palpable on them.
horses for courses indeed.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Jun 4, 2013 19:26:51 GMT
I also use the modded T40 and the padded T50 more than anything else. They have slightly different sound sigs which is nice. The T50 has more 'heft' in the bass than the T40 which is also slightly less sensitive, but flatter.
I must admit, it IS a relief to get them back on since they are a lot easier to listen to really.
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