AVI ADM9RS Mini Review

In short, HD 650 and AVI ADM9RS are very close to each other in overall performance with AVI may be being a bit better overall, in several aspects that too. But both are very comparable.

Are you comparing a headphone with speakers here? I presume the ADM AVI 9RS are speakers?

How do they compare to HD800 ?

After more usage, their strengths and weaknesses are more evident.

If you want HD 650 (about equal, better in some ways, worse in others) in speaker form albeit with slightly lesser bass and slightly more neutral, then AVI ADM 9RS should be the obvious choice.

HD 650 are more musical, sweeter and lusher. AVI are more neutral (which I like actually), slightly cleaner, slightly more transparent. Imaging of both is very good. Centerstaging of AVI is definitely better. AVI is also less grainy. AVI is very refined and resolving for a speaker setup

Both are excellent and kings at their respective tasks Having both together is much more than a dream come true

Thank You so much!

Aakshey

(Like Ian I suspect), I don't understand how you can usefully compare headphones to speakers. They both operate in such wildy different environments that I feel there are almost no valid comparators. The old adage of "trying to compare Apples and Oranges" surely applies here??


Thank you very much.     

Hello

I'm Ashley James and one of the directors of AVI, the company that designs and makes Techboy's ADM9RS. They are unique active speakers in that they have a remote controlled, multi input preamp and DAC built in.

Properly designed, so not all Active speakers, can be considerably more clear than passive or legacy speakers. This is because the action of a passive crossover is to progressively disconnect and so sacrifice control of the drivers. In active speakers the crossover is electronic and before power amps of which there is one per driver. The result is damping or control is improved by a factor of typically between 200-300. Secondly active filters can be much steeper. We use 24 dB/Oct whereas many passive speakers use 6dB/Oct meaning that the tweeter in a two way is audible below the crossover for a couple of octaves and distorting and adding to the inevitable congestion passives suffer from as you increase volume. Thirdly active crossovers don't use inductors, which add quite a lot of distortion and it worsens as power input rises.

Typically, passive speakers boom because bass isn't as well controlled and tizz because the crossover is audible and driver control is poor. Even cheap actives with with cheap drivers sound much more clear.

The market has changed, hi fi is dying, having been replaced by headphones that outsell it many times over. Headphones are the standard by which younger people judge speakers and the unpalatable truth is that even iPods as come with an iPhone better most separates HiFi systems for clarity and lack of distortion. They are less fatiguing to listen to and more enjoyable, although they do not image like the best speaker systems do.

I'm guessing that Techboy is young and for him it's a natural comparison, but not for board members who are die hard hi fi fanatics. However don't ridicule him because there are more on the way. He is the way things are going.

I'm in the UK and last year ten million pairs of headphones sold, the business is worth more than all the rest of consumer electronics together and even the cheap ones connected to a phone sound better than most hi fi.

Sennheiser were the first with hi fi headphones and they quickly found favour in broadcasting and for the balancing of Classical or acoustic music on location where monitor speakers may not be practical. It soon became obvious to engineers that they could hear more from them than speakers, so were very useful to avoid the noise of underground trains etc that they didn't want customers to hear and complain about. Now we recommend to our customers that they use headphones when assessing any potential hi fi purchase.

I hope this helps.

PS. I've worked for my first hi fi company in the early sixties and for ATC before AVI, so I have a basic understanding.

Hi Ashley James,

Welcome to the forum.
Even though we are a headphone audio based forum we don't mind a speaker here and there.

On the damping factor I agree an active amp with very short wiring creates nice 'numbers'.
Alas this does not say anything about the effect of this and actual 'damping' of a speaker.
Have had discussions about damping factors MANY times before where people shove it forward as being important.

Truth of the matter is that a damping factor of 1000 and 100 (and even smaller) is academical as electrical damping is caused by current.
Since current is determined by generated voltage (speaker acts as a microphone) and its source, the voicecoils DC resistance of the driver, which is in series with the output resistance of the wiring (XO when passive) and amplifier.
As they are in series the current, which is the one that does the dampening as a load, doesn't really differ when a 'load' the driver 'sees' is 4.004 Ohm or 4.04 Ohm even when the damping factor is 10 Ohm the damping current (and thus action) is only 10% less.
I wonder why manufacturers keep bringing this number up as an argument of 'optimal sound'
It doesn't work for me as an argument unless someone can convince me with objective data that proves otherwise.

I fully agree with active filters outperforming passive ones though have been using DIY active systems for decades.
They are easier/cheaper to make as well and more flexible.
Also am quite convinced your speakers sound good (for their size and even compared to somewhat bigger sized passive ones) and look good as well.
Women will love them as they are small in size.

Personal audio is getting 'hot' and very expensive indeed.

I do not have anything against Aakshey and can even understand his reasoning as a 'beginner' in audio.
Knowing I have 'flat' speakers myself I too have sometimes used them to make quick comparisons to see if the FR is reasonably accurate.

I share Rabbit's concern about 'beginners' reviews though.

What one cannot see is the rather large amount of 'remarks' and questions that had been asked may times before and on all fora (most of us are active on other fora as well).
This has P'ed-off many regulars here and on other fora and this is why his reviews are watched with a certain degree of scepticism (euphemism).
More than half of his posts have been moved because of this but funnily is what most regulars remember.



I can understand negativity in a thread that concerns someone's product is not good advertising.
The problem here is NOT the product but the 'reviewer'
When one reads the HD650 thread for instance he/she becomes aware that the AVI was first deemed MUCH better than HD650 and the more posts you read they start to be 'on par' and differences became smaller over time.

Comparing stereo imaging between headphones and speakers for instance is not the wisest thing to do especially when numbers are attached to it giving it a semi scientific look/feel which it isn't as you cannot compare this aspect this way.
The review is more HIS opinion than a 'fact of life' and is why the reaction is quite strong bringing negative words about something no-one here has heard nor would probably buy, regardless how it sounds.

Defending someone that is inexperienced in doing and writing reviews without knowing the background of that reviewer, just because the review is favourable for that product, may be a questionable motive.

Will have a look at 'cleaning' the thread but I fear only the review will remain (which is found on lots of websites forums anyway) and most on here do not discuss speakers especially those most of us haven't heard.
I can understand your concerns in this matter though, certainly as You an Martin are trying to build something and with the years of experience you have will work quite fine.

It would be great if you are also interested in what we do and say about other products and would really like it you visit us from time to time if personal audio is one of your interests.

We are really interested in opinions of others, certainly of those who have been in this business for a long time.

To Aakshey/newcomers in writing reviews I would advise: don't post your first impressions directly.. live with the product and test it and become aware of it's pros and cons and then post your findings.
NEVER say this or that 'beats' something else, in stead say you prefer it over this or that with arguments.