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Post by tunkejazz on Jan 23, 2016 16:39:01 GMT
Hi guys, I have been looking for a DAP to go on the tube. My Z3 compact has a very annoying volume limit and with demanding cans I barely get a decent volume level.
Thought about the Fiio X3ii (maybe 2dn hand).
Can you recommend that option or anything else?
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oldson
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Post by oldson on Jan 23, 2016 17:32:10 GMT
i really like my x1 and reckon from what i have read on here, the x3 would be a good choice.
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Post by tunkejazz on Jan 23, 2016 18:04:59 GMT
Thanks! I have been reading about the X3 here but I guess most comments refer to the older version.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Jan 23, 2016 18:41:23 GMT
One of the biggest differences between the X1 and X3 is the fact that the X3 offers digital out. It's a great way to use the dap, plus the fact that it has a good headphone out with power to drive nicely.
I love the X1 since it's really cheap and works really well. Just an analogue line out, which is fine and plays hi resolution files too. X3 with digital out is my favourite. One of the reasons is that the old one doesn't have the wheel. However, if I were to buy another dap, I think it might be this one for the digital output. X3 is luxurious. A bit bigger than the other two but offers digital out as well. Plays very high res but one thing.... This is perhaps only me ..... When I go outside, I tend to use the X1 because it's cheaper and not so big.
I use the X5 more with a digital amp and the X3 doubles up for garden duty and indoors.
So I guess my personal choice would be the middle one, X3. Is it the cost of the new X3 that puts you off or do you want one without the wheel?
They're all excellent tbh.
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Post by tunkejazz on Jan 23, 2016 18:55:36 GMT
Thanks for your detailed comments Ian. I like the new X3 2nd gen, I guess I would go for it :-)
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Jan 23, 2016 19:00:44 GMT
It's a lovely sounding dap. You get a case with it, but I also bought a leather flip type one which is much better for in your pocket. There's a good bit of power from the headphone out as well.
It's the one I'd buy for luxury, or the X1 for cheapness. Sound of the X1 is excellent and imo, lots of reports about it with comparisons seem to be a bit overstated to me.
I never regretted getting an X3 in any way. Brilliant via digital out.
What I love about it is the excellent sound, excellent build, the ease of changing the card and being able to just drop albums onto the card either via the X3 or direct (which is quicker) using a little key fob device that holds the card and inserts into the usb. It's really quick. Plus it is pretty unfussy about formats as well.
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Post by tunkejazz on Jan 23, 2016 20:32:37 GMT
I won't be buying it right now, I need to save up for a while to be able to afford it without surprises at the end of the month :-)
I will be checking the 2nd hand market too!
Once again, thanks guys!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2016 23:55:28 GMT
Used to be when you looked up "Good, Affordable, DAP", in the dictionary it showed a picture of a Sansa Clip. Good? - Check. Affordable? - Check.
Nowadays you need to have a touchscreen, or an on-board DAC, or the ability to play DSD files, etc, etc.
So, a "Good, Affordable, DAP" used to cost £25 or so.
If we take the Fiio X1 as the entry point to this brave new world, it now it costs four times as much.
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Post by tunkejazz on Jan 24, 2016 7:03:43 GMT
I agree with you! But something like the Sansa will not drive some of my cans nicely :-(
...I have seen the x3ii for ~£130 (2nd hand) which is sort of ok.
The disturbing thing is that there are players out there that cost £500+ and you just read complains about how they sound!
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Jan 24, 2016 8:13:36 GMT
You can just about drive an hd650 from the X3 without an amp but digital out is even better.
The Sansas are good. Not as good as the Fiios because they're not as powerful and the interface is pretty crude to say the least. Also, I think maximum card size is 32GB as opposed to 128GB. That allows you to play and store higher quality files because there's room to store a ton of them. Sansas won't play hi res. I think they're also limited as to which formats they play where the Fiios have quite a wide repetoire of file types.
I think the storage thing is important because although it's easy to change music on cards, you do have to get the computer out and physically find and move it. All well and good when you don't have too many files but once your collection grows, it can be a pain. I have quite a lot of cards stored in a wallet and it's useful when you want something different, you just change the cards with preloaded ones. 128gb cards equals four 32gb so my card collection would quadruple virtually.
Also, from line out or digital out, the Fiio does make a good home source as well and feeds a pretty robust signal via both outputs into an amp. I think my most used device is either the X1 or X3. So easy to plug in and play.
Best thing about the Sansas is that they are really cheap for a decent sound but by comparison are also quite limited really.
The Sansa is brilliant value though for what it is and you don't worry so much about damaging or losing it when mobile.
If you go for a large card, think very carefully about the filing system before transferring though. If you fill a 128gb card, that's a lot of music to shift through.
This sounds ovd, but I have genres/artist/album which allows me to find things quicker with big cards. The sorting method on the Fiios isn't the best imo and 'Browse' is the best way to find music and get it in the correct order.
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Post by tunkejazz on Jan 24, 2016 19:02:57 GMT
Ian, thanks for your very detailed explanation, I am almost set.
Just one final question: would I get a similar (or better?) sound by using an e17k+phone as player? I guess it bakes down to whether the dac in the e17 is better or not. Significantly cheaper though but bulkier...
I hope this was not "one question too much", it is very hard to demo fiio products in Sweden. Most sellers operate online :-(
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Jan 24, 2016 19:28:29 GMT
I don't really know the answer to that one tbh. My guess is that you might be hard pushed to tell, but at least the Fiio gives you a very wide choice of formats and whether it's just expectation bias or not, I do feel that hi res is actually the way to go with memory being cheap to buy now.
It protects your music for later when hi res might well become the norm but also, you can always convert down to a format for something like a Sansa Clip if you wanted to. Converting up is a waste of time but it is possible to take it down with not too much problem. Purists might scream at me, but hey ... It's portable entertainmnet!
Handy if you're anywhere dodgy and are worried about something like the Fiio getting dropped or nicked or wet or whatever!! If the Sansa or Clip got drowned, you wouldn't be losing too much; especially if the files were lower res copies anyway.
I don't know the e17 that well. Looking at it, if you are going to use it portable, that screen might get a bit scratched up. It might be like quite a bit of Fiio stuff, a little soft in the treble. Don't quote me on that though.
The option that I really like is to use a Fiio e12a portable from the line out of the X3. Using the rubber band that comes with the amp, I bolt the two of them together, so in effect, you have one unit. I keep the e12 or X3 bagged up so they don't get scratched. Superb sound. The reason I say e12a and not e12 is that it runs much quieter for low impedance headphones. Very quiet in fact and still quite powerful.
I keep digital output mostly at home into a posh little Ifi idsd which costs quite a lot. Portable, I use a very cheap and cheerful Topping amp. All of £20-£30.
There is nothing at all wrong with the Fiio X3 line out. It's a healthy sounding signal and I often use it that way into the Polaris or at the moment, my Aune amp digitally.
The X3 is really quite versatile having a really good headphone out direct. Good line out and a good digital out, so it makes a good home unit as well as portable.
That's why I think it's a great value unit since it can be used easily in different types of set ups and is capable of really high quality.
If you don't want to use digital out to a dac, then the X1 is a bargain. The combo of that from the line out into the E12a is just as good imo and makes a great listen albeit without a digital signal available. But that combo would cost the same as a new X3 and still sounds excellent.
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Post by tunkejazz on Jan 24, 2016 19:31:01 GMT
Ok, I am set. Thanks!
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Jan 24, 2016 19:32:48 GMT
Next comes getting hold of digital files!!!!!
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Post by tunkejazz on Jan 24, 2016 19:55:48 GMT
I have had all my cd collection ripped in flac format both at work and at bome for some time ;-) CDs break, especially with a 3 year old terrorist patrolling the apartment.
So I just need to start filling up memory cards once I get it!
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