Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 28, 2015 8:05:26 GMT
What about that Mission silver stuff, that was dead stiff and didn't bend around corners? You literally had to bend it into shape.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2015 10:34:28 GMT
Yup, I remember that too. The idea was that you could run it under carpets but who really does that?
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 28, 2015 12:04:19 GMT
Not at all good really and actually affected the sound of my speakers.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 1:53:29 GMT
I think the biggest (but not the only) issue I have with the Nighthawk at present is the low end. It dominates, sometimes when I wouldn't expect it to (big no-no for me), and I find the way it presents bass in general to be quite unlike any headphone I've heard before.
The quantity is undeniable but it's not what I would personally think of as quality bass. It's like a solid mass and it lacks the fluidity, punch, texture and subtlety some of the better headphones I've owned possess.
I really don't know. Every now and then I get an elusive wee glimpse of something where I think I get what the designer was aiming for and there are some tracks the NH feels 'right' but sadly these moments are all too fleeting.
If this is an adjustment period I'm currently in then it's by far the longest I've experienced (an hour is usually more than enough). Giving it another couple of days before throwing in the towel but right now I'm just not feeling the love.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 9:45:02 GMT
I've read various things about burn-in, the most bizarre claiming that it can take up to 1000 hours! lol.
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solderdude
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Post by solderdude on Nov 29, 2015 10:57:10 GMT
EQ might solve most of it's problems. If I could measure one a Kameleon filter could be constructed.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 11:08:05 GMT
1000 hours lol. That sounds to me more like denial or submission I may have only owned one headphone that I've listened to more than a thousand hours....and I liked that one enough to want to. I do believe in mental adjustment and think you quickly form a general opinion on a headphone. Whilst your appreciation or dislike for certain elements might soften or increase over time I think if you strong like or dislike a headphone that opinion won't be completely turned on its head no matter how long you give it. I'm not sure I buy into the theory of mechanical burn in but I've not completely ruled it out either (at least for the first 30-50 hours). No harm, no foul as the Americans say. I don't know how many hours the Nighthawk has had but they were bought in August so I suspect they've had enough to burn-in. Anyway after a good night's sleep and some time to mull things over I've decided to sell the NH on. I did want to like them but they're just not for me.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 11:16:33 GMT
I don't tend to use EQ Frans. Partially because I feel like I'm stabbing in the dark and also because I use streaming services which don't tend to support it.
Dale Thorne mentioned some EQ settings he uses in his review so I had a brief and very crude stab using the basic equaliser in JRiver (playing some FLAC files I had on my HDD), whereas Dale uses some kind of parametric EQ. It did work to an extent but tonally the NH still felt off and there was a lot of distortion (sounded like clipping) evident. I believe it's better to EQ down but Dale was also also adding +4-5 db in places so possibly that was the culprit?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 11:17:41 GMT
Mechanical burn-in does happen. It may happen in the factory before being shipped or it may happen on the users head but it definitely happens. Whether it can be heard by the human ear is another matter and entirely up for debate.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 11:24:21 GMT
Absolutely Gordon. It's more the notion that mechanical burn-in can hugely, or even noticeably, change a headphone's sound I have more trouble with. If someone else does then I completely respect that but to me it feels more plausible that there is another factor at play (the human mind being one).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 11:45:39 GMT
I agree but something definitely happened with my HD 650. My friend confirmed it too. I know it's not scientific but hey, life's too short. I haven't had that experience with any other headphone though. Speakers? Definitely. Every pair. Which goes some way to explaining why I believe it must also happen with headphones.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 11:56:19 GMT
I think I mentioned before but the one headphone that stops me from dispelling the notion is my old Denon D2K. They improved way more than I could have imagined but whether that was other changes to my set up (I had the Denon for a good few years), pads changing shape or a long burn-in period I have no idea.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 29, 2015 12:04:43 GMT
I found the Denon better long term as well!! I started by being extremely impressed with its bass in particular. It was heavy though. Whether I've become accustomed to it or not I don't know, but it just doesn't seem as 'fluid' in the bass as I felt it did at the start. Might be pads deflating, I don't really know.
It is less sharp in the top than the th900 and for some things, I use it in preference because of that.
Mine has shiny cups now. One got scratched, so I polished the scratch out and the cups went glass like. Looks really nice.
I still like the d2000 a lot in spite of what people have said about its bass. I find the bass is great TBH.
How on earth Dale works out those eq curves, I have no idea. They seem a bit rough and ready imo, unless he's perhaps using one headphone as a reference and tries to eq another to sound like it. Seems a bit hit and miss.
His standard list of songs also gets a bit tiresome since he copies and pastes the same old comments. The subjective description is way more helpful in his reviews. He's a nice chap though and has a very wide experience of headphones.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2015 15:19:18 GMT
I loved the bass on the D2000 too. It's big, it's a bit flabby but it's also very more-ish and as a headphone I think they just sound lovely and smooth. Perhaps they're what some people might describe as having more of a 'fun' sound but I had a lot of time for it.
When I was out of work I really had to balance the books so I had to sell things off to fund my next purchase. I don't regret selling many but I do wish I'd kept the Denon and HD600.
I like the idea of those shiny cups! Have you ever had any issues with the hinge mechanism on yours Ian as that seems to be a common issue as they get older?
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I do like Dale too. Oddly we seem to rate a lot of the same headphones very highly and yet he applies quite heavy EQ whereas I don't.
The thing I like about his reviews is that I get the feeling he writes them purely because he enjoys this hobby rather than for any personal gain. If a company doesn't offer him a review sample he'll go ahead and buy it anyway and given an honest opinion.
The EQ thing is a problem as it means I can't really rely on his reviews verbatim as the sound has been skewed towards his 'ideal'. However, they are informative and well considered I think. Agree that the list of songs feels a bit of a cut & paste at times but I do like the fact that he gives an insight into why he uses a particular track.
His video reviews sometimes seem a bit less focussed to me and the Nighthawk review (or was it the follow up) in particular felt rather meandering. He's one of the good guys imho though.
-- Looks like the Fostex drop is losing some steam now. They were selling like hotcakes initially but the last 200-300 units are taking a while to shift. Still 1600 or so units in a couple of days is pretty brisk business.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 29, 2015 16:03:00 GMT
I haven't had an issue with the hinge. Pretty amazing that exactly the same issue applies to the th900 at the price it sells for as well. Would have been nice if they didn't spare the cash and put a locknut on the inside but there you go!!!
I treat them both very gently. I got the cups to be 'glassy' looking by just rubbing with a compound called 'Displex'. It's designed for scratches in plastic but I've used it for all kinds of things. I thought I'd get the scratch out and found that it went to an extremely 'gloss' finish. Looks really pretty. In fact, the gloss matches the red gloss of the th900 that everyone goes on about.
I think the Fostex drop lost its steam when people felt that it is in fact, a th600 in disguise. I know that mass drop is good, but some of the items need checking out occasionally. I'm a bit suspicious of the AKG K7xx thing. My K702 doesn't sound that glassy with those pads and that's all there is to it really. Stick the K702 cups onto the K701 and they become similar. I did the same with the old K691 and the K612 and both become mellow.
So imo, a lot of the hype around the k7xx may well have been a simple pad thing. Many claim that it's as good as a k712, but I'm not sure of that if I'm honest.
Th900 is well worth having. It's a great headphone actually, but for that damned price . (And stupid cup attachment)
I battled with the idea of hd800, one of the HE series or the TH900 and it was Mick that helped me make a decision in the end. I find that his preferences are pretty close to mine (as well as Frans) and he went in favour of the th900 and its fruity bass himself. Then I followed it up with the Ifi Micro idsd thanks to him!! Great combo.
Actually, the Fiio e12a amp drives the d2000 beautifully as well as the th900. I use it an awful lot since it has reduced noise in comparison with the e12 which I also have; especially with low impedance headphones.
The Massdrop deal didn't really tempt me at all, although I wouldn't mind buying a th600. They're not far away from the th900!!
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