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Post by elysion on Nov 7, 2015 20:23:15 GMT
I don't find the k702 as bad as I used to at all. ... K702 is really good for speech/radio. I have quite a few cables for them as well. The cheaply Pioneer ones are really not bad at all. Maybe it's all about the appropriate application for the K70x's. They're really good for speech, where my DT990 has a weakness. I'm often listening to electronic music, which is often bass heavy and is certainly not a good terrain for K70x's. When I came home quite late last night, I had the impulse to watch a documentary on YouTube. One of the first search results was a documentary about the Broadmoor Psychiatric Hospital: www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-G5mC5WTDYI've noticed that it was often very hard for me to understand the people in the documentary. Sure, some of them talk a hard to understand slang. But I don't think is was (only) the language and/or the quality of the recording, which made it hard for me to understand the people. I listened with the DT990 and this is certainly an application, where it fails. This is a good reason to excavate my K702 though to do a comparison. Iniatially, I was very impressed by the K702. The enourmous soundstage make it and his other AKG comrades outstanding in a special way. Because it has an almost completely open back, it is also one of the heaphones, which fuses the surrounding environment strongly with what you're hearing through the headphone itself. This is a good thing sometimes and sometimes it is the opposite. While I prefer the DT990 and HD650 for listening to my preferred sound style (Dark Ambient), the big soundstage and the "fusing" with the environment around me was certainly a plus for the K702, but was accompanied by its other weaknesses. It's funny that I did not sell it, although I never got completely warm with it. It's a kind of love-hate relationship. I have to admit that I really love its look and manufacturing quality. The detachable cable is also nice and, usually, I'm using it with a coiled AKG cable. I'm curious to hear the newer AKG headphones, but I guess they still wouldn't be optimal for what I'm listening most often.
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Rabbit
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 7, 2015 20:34:34 GMT
I find many of the AKG's sound better at low volume tbh. Then, they kind of merge with room sounds and almost become invisible. Hd650 and dt990 are nice up loud. Hd650 more so. Speech can be boomy though.
I always find speech a good indicator as to how 'flat' headphones are. Women's voices can quickly show sibilance and mens voices, the boom in mid bass. Then I find recordings with low bass to test for sub bass info.
Then I tend to use orchestral music to test for timbre and space.
After that, I give up and relax!!!
The K712 is a good all rounder.
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Post by elysion on Nov 7, 2015 21:45:46 GMT
I relistened some parts of the above mentioned documentary with the K702. Voices are much better to unterstand and the overall experience is also better than with the DT990. I'll give the K702 a new chance.
What about the pads? We did test several AKG pads with different AKG headphones a few years back and using not the original pads (for example K601 pads with K702 or K702 pads with K501 etc.) was not successful. Do the K712 pads have the same basic shape as the K702 pads? Maybe it could be worth to try the K712 pads with K70x, but I can't predict how the influence of the memory foam will be. Memory foam means also that the shape of the pads will adapt to the ears/head of the listener and this could led to a different experience amongst different listeners. The distance between the ears and the drivers could vary therefore. Pads from other headphones often also wear out with time and sometimes this leads to a closer distance between ears and drivers. The AKG pads, which I do know personally, seem to be rather stable in their form though.
BTW: Is there a difference between the normal K702 and the K702 "65th anniversary edition" beside the different colour and the headband, which has now the same shape as that of the K712?
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 7, 2015 22:17:18 GMT
I'm not sure Christian. It may just be colour changes for anniversary edition.
The k712 pads are quite heavy memory foam covered with velour. They may make the sound 'heavier' as a result. The k702 are original foam pads, but Thomann sell some very nice angled pads for the K702. They beef up the K612 and I think I preferred them that way in the end.
It may just be a pad thing. The K702 angled pads are quite smart looking. My K702 pads aren't angled though. That may account for them sounding thinner than the K712.
I do tend to listen at lower volumes on the K702 though.
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Post by elysion on Nov 7, 2015 23:12:18 GMT
It did appreciate the K702 this evening for listening to the speech in the documentary and it was a comfortable listening. I have switched back to music (Dark Ambient) afterwards and I did not withstand it longer than about 20-30 minutes. The music sounded too flat and the bass was completely gone. It has certainly also a relation to the used amp (built-in amp of the Xonar Essence STX which sounds wonderful with the DT990 or HD650). I will give it another try in the next few days with the X-Can V3.
I'm almost only listening at low volume, because I'm listening very often over prolonged periods and I hate ear-fatigue. I can always hear my fingers tapping on the desk clearly and I hear also my Swatch ticking when I hold it on the outside of the earcups. One of my friends is listening often at volume levels which would blow away my ears, but he finds that volume normal and comfortable.
For the next few hours, the HD650 will be my companion. It must be months ago since I had it on my head the last time.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2015 1:48:09 GMT
There's an interesting comparison between the various AKGs hereThe K712 pads will fit the K702 but they aren't exactly cheap: www.thomann.de/gb/akg_k_702_gel_ear_pad.htmPrice has actually come down considerably since I last looked at them as they were previously selling for around £70 (just under €100)! Edit: sorry, the pad price is still the same. Forgot the price quoted is per pad. Madness.
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 8, 2015 9:10:19 GMT
I used these ones with the K601 and 612; www.thomann.de/gb/akg_k_702_ohrpolster.htmI'd like to try the gel ones actually. (I don't think they mean memory foam by gel) Pads that are expensive as some good headphones ...... Maybe my k712 pads are gel, not memory foam? They are good.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2015 11:44:51 GMT
The K712 does indeed have gel pads Ian. My understanding is that AKG also uses them on the K7XX and current revision of the K702 Anniversary.
I know people refer to them as K712 pads but technically I think the Anniversary got them first when AKG did a stealth revision. The part no. is 5021871 possibly pre-fixed with 'EAK'.
Not sure how easy they are to remove but should fit onto your K702 if you wanted to try them.
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 8, 2015 12:10:23 GMT
They are very nice pads. They change their shape to fit your head, but equally, they change their shape if you store them with nothing to stop the cups touching. They hold the shape for quite a while like comply tips!
It is more likely that those pads are helping create the warmth of the K712 I reckon. I found the same with the angled K702 pads which warmed up my old K601 nicely. Much more like a Senn headphone like that. The original k601 pads seemed to suck the life out of the headphone by comparison.
I reckon the gel pads are the answer for the edginess of the K702. I'm a bit reluctant to be pulling off my k712 pads - don't want to harm them, but when my k702 pads get tired, I might do a gel replacement I think instead of the standard pads in spite of the cost.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2015 13:05:36 GMT
Very good pads and I suspect you are right when you say they warm the sound up. AKG quote 3dB improved low end and the pads likely contribute to that. I wonder if the circular foam ' polo' over the driver is their to tame the highs a bit (not sure if the K702 has that too?). They do behave a lot like the Comply tips and I like the fact that they don't get overly warm with extended listening. I seem to remember my old HD600 getting rather toasty! Pad swapping doesn't look like it should be too tricky actually Ian....at least on paper!" I found the parts guide on AKG's website and they give some guidance on removing the pads: "Hints for repair: Cushions 19 have a bayonet lock. Turn them counter-clockwise for taking them off". K612 / 712 parts guide
Edit: yup. Just tried and dead easy. Hold the cushion between thumb & forefinger and turn the pad 10-15 degrees counter clockwise. Doesn't need a whole lot of force. Now to see if I can put it back on! Edit 2: putting back on isn't too bad either but may need a couple of attempts to get all the tabs to lock. There are 3 locking tabs on the earpiece - make sure the corresponding holes on the pads are positioned directly above these, then push the pad down and rotate clockwise to lock. Sometimes only a couple of the tabs might lock and if that happens the pad will hang loose where it failed to lock. The best way to avoid this is to place your hand over the entire pad so you get even pressure at all 3 points when pushing the pad downward and whilst rotating. Even weight distribution is the trick. Edit 3: the foam ring may fall out whilst removing the pads but there is a plastic groove it sits in so easy to re-position it again before putting the pads back on.
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 8, 2015 13:31:59 GMT
I've done it quite a few times on my old 601 and 612. Do it too often and you end up crushing the pads to death and they start to collapse.
I found that two tabs caught very often and one might miss. You don't find out until you go round the rim trying to lift the velour gently and you suddenly find that one side comes away!!
That ring is a pain to keep still as well if you're not careful and it ends up off centre.
It's not too bad, but quite faffy.
I had to use three fingers to put pressure down where the three tabs are. Then twist with those three fingers!!!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2015 13:34:16 GMT
I wish there was a Gel pad option for the HD 650. I would buy them.
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 8, 2015 13:35:43 GMT
So would I Gordon. They are really nice. They fit exactly to your head. I'm not sure if they'd fatten the sound up more though. I think some have tried soft leather pads.
Originally, I thought gel pads might be quite hard but in fact, they are really pliable. That's why I thought mine were memory foam.
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Post by elysion on Nov 8, 2015 20:06:10 GMT
IIRC, Beyerdynamic was the first vendor of gel pads. Never got a change to try them though. Their pads had a focus on more isolation, but I'm not completely sure. Probably it is a part more appropriate for DT770 (closed-back) instead of DT880 or DT990 (open-back respectively half-open). But maybe I'm wrong. The DT770 has a tendency to be too "boomy" anyway, while the DT990 are just right IMHO. I'm curious if the DT880 would be a candidate for gel pads.
I'm even more curious about the K712 gel pads with the K702. If this is the cure for the K702 weaknesses, then it would be a worthwhile upgrade.
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Post by Rabbit on Nov 9, 2015 8:36:10 GMT
It might be Christian, but they are pretty expensive pads.
The K702 angled pads did beef up my old k601. I don't think they're the same as the standard ones either, which are not angled on mine. That surprised me because I thought Thomann's replacement pads would be the same, but I prefer theirs to AKG's. If you ha pave non angled pads on yours, the Thomann angled ones do change the sound. I think they're just foam so not as expensive.
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