Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Sept 24, 2014 14:25:27 GMT
I will hopefully get my hands on one next week. Looks quite interesting and a good alternative to an IPod. At least Itunes can be dumped as well.
Baby brother to X3 and X5 and doesn't have quite the same output as them but it looks promising in that it seems quite tough looking and is able to play higher resolution stuff too.
Looking forward to hearing another dap.
|
|
Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Sept 26, 2014 18:14:17 GMT
Looking at specs the frequency response is quoted as 200 HZ to 20khz no real deep bass then?
Must be a mistake, although it appears in two places like that!! Checked Fiio site and they quote 20 to 20khz there!!!
|
|
solderdude
Administrator
measureutternutter
Posts: 4,882
|
Post by solderdude on Sept 26, 2014 20:06:36 GMT
Their website is also filled with Chinglish. You would expect they would throw in a good translator for their English site. It goes lower than 20Hz (possibly below 5Hz) The mild roll-off in the treble is also present in the X3 and is caused by the used filtering (no steep filters)
|
|
Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Sept 26, 2014 21:21:41 GMT
I looked on Amazon, Frans and another site. Immediately thought that it would be very much lacking until I looked on the Fiio site. It's coming from China so is taking a while. Long way for a review unit to go. Looking forward to seeing how it performs though. They're going to sell in the UK for £99 so it's hit a good price point if it has a decent quality sound.
|
|
Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Oct 4, 2014 8:04:35 GMT
The X1 has arrived so this morning, I had a quick look, a listen and the stuck it on charge.
So far, wow. The package itself is very compact and minimal really with the X1 packed inside a black silicone cover. It makes you think that Fiio have thought about who is using it. It is a mobile device and so will move around. A lot of us go and buy a cover automatically for devices like this. This cover is quite thick. I have noticed in the past that some of these covers are quite thin and unsubstantial, but this one has some weight to it.
Also included are three stick on covers, which are quite funny really. one is black with a silver pattern, a wood effect one and the other is an American flag type one. (Not great for European markets!!) They are shaped to fit the X1 exactly, but I don't think I'll be sticking them on. In the end, they might start to peel off - I don't know. You know how guitar and keyboard amps are covered by a veneer (with cheap old chipboard underneath), well that sometimes peels up with industrial use!!
You also get some screen protectors in the box, so Fiio has thought about who is using it. The silicone covers cost around £9 for an 'ok' one and I'm not sure what we'd be charged for protectors, but take the cost off the dap and it's getting quite low for what you get really.
The X1 looks incredibly like an Ipod, which I thought was quite funny. It has a rotary wheel on the front which is very smooth but unlike the Ipod, it is a physical wheel that actually turns, where the Ipod is a touch senstive wheel and doesn't go round and round. The wheel feels very smooth and looks like it'll be ok. I always worry about things like this coming off later!! Or worse, getting caught on something in your pocket and then getting wrenched off when you pull it out. This looks like it'll survive. I have a digital radio with one of these wheels and it isn't as secure as the Fiio one.
There are four buttons around the scroll wheel that are hidden under the silicon sleeve that feel very positive when pushed. There are also volume and on/off butons on the side.
The look is really nice. I quite like it actually, since I know that Fiio was playing around with different designs at the time he was putting this together. The look is really nice and he's done a great job on the design as well as the interface. It has quite a small screen on the front - again - Ipod Classic like but it serves the purpose well. It's not really bright or contrasty but in my eyes, anything that conserves power is a good thing. It's all very well having a flashy, bright screen that is big, but this can impact on battery life if you switch on and off a lot, so this may be like this for the conservation of power. It's not a bad screen, but it's not one of yer flashy ones either.
The casing of the X1 seems quite solid and flex free. USB charge socket at the bottom. No separate line out socket. The headphone socket is labelled as line out as well as headphone. That's one thng I would have liked - a separate line out, free of the vol pot.
So, I inserted a 32Gb card full of music. (You have to take the silicone case off - no slot provided in the case) First unusual thing is that the card goes in with the pins facing upwards!! That is the other way around to other daps. It was when the card almost stuck in the slot that I realised. So I turned it around and gently slid the card in.
Switch on gives you a language selection and you're off.
I expected a long wait for the X1 to read the card, like the Sansa devices. They do a long search and in the case of 32 Gb, it can take quite a while. The X1 reads it in seconds. I have no idea how it works so quickly but it was so quick, that I thought that the card couldn't be working. Files appeared and so I used the middle of the wheel to select one and that was it. Really simple. Quick and absolutely no fuss.
This beats the Ipod hands down on set up. By now, I'd be booting up Itunes, loading music onto the damned software and then ticking boxes for what I want on the dap, etc. It's a long winded procedure that I absolutely hate. In fact, I hate it so much that I actually wrote to Apple and told them that Itunes was a piece of crap that needed to be dumped a long time ago. Of course, I got no reply.
This is simplicity. You load up a card and just stick it in the X1 card slot. That's it. That's a major advantage over Ipods.
I had a quick listen - coulldn't resist, before putting it on charge. Advantage two - LOUD. No stupid volume restriction in place. Maybe I should say - loud and clean sounding. Put simply, this sounds really good. Nice bass weight and crystal up top.
The only disadvantage over the Ipod basically, is the line out imo. The Ipods sound cleaner and more defined from line out into an amp. Headphone out from them isn't all that. Not as good as this. On higher resolution files - this starts to fly. To be honest, I don't get hung up on high resolution files, but this works well so if you're into all that business of bits and bytes, this is good. My files are mostly 320 with some WAVS and 192 stuff floating around. I don't really worry too much or else you become a nervous wreck and a bit OCD aboout it. If you want the ultimate in high fidelity, go to a concert!!
Fact is, the X1 is a bargain to say the least imo. The set up is almost invisible. Card reading isn't noticed. Volume is BIG. (Probably not as big as the X3 though) Wonderful through the HD598. It has a clean sound with a kick in it and I see this as a better version of an Ipod.
Within minutes of trying it, I got converted to its simplicity and honesty of sound. The idea that the memory is no longer limited and I just have to change a card to have more music or even separate it by genre using different cards means it's an unlimited machine as far as memory goes.
In a word, it's a really good device and preferable to an Ipod Classic.
Once it's charged, I'll go through loads of music for a detailed listen and maybe even compare the same files on a Classic and the smaller Apple devices, but imo, Apple are faced with a problem with this little dap. It makes their daps look WAY overrpriced.
Here's the problem - I like the X1 so much, I am really tempted to go for an X5 now. They are seriously good players and I think Ipods are going to be leaving the building here!! Joking aside, I'll have a good listen for a while now before turfing the Classics out but first impressions of the X1 have left me really positive and feeling that at last, I've found a quality player that is unbelievably easy to set up and use.
£99 for something that plays as well as this is a really good price and I honestly can't see me returninig to Apple devices again after this.
|
|
solderdude
Administrator
measureutternutter
Posts: 4,882
|
Post by solderdude on Oct 4, 2014 8:21:43 GMT
When my Fuze stops working I may well buy this... or its successor should the Fuze last a few years more The 4 buttons that are on the X1 spread around the jog dial are 'integrated' in the wheel with the Fuze. Unlike the buttons on the X1 the functions are marked. With the X1 you would have to familiarize yourself with what button does exactly what. The same as with the X3 (with a sleeve on it) except on the X3 the buttons are in a non-intuitive configuration
|
|
Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Oct 4, 2014 8:34:43 GMT
It's way quicker than the Fuze when reading cards, Frans. Build is also streets ahead. I think the Fuze may be leaving the building too tbh. I don't like the build quality of them tbh, but then again, the sound is very good as well. The X1 is an Ipod killer I think. Ease of use and sound are much better. I'm definitely thinking more in terms of an X3 or 5 now, although the main advantages for me would be increased power rather than ability to play massive files. The button configuration seems pretty intuitive to me, Frans. I instantly accessed what I wanted without any worries. In fact, I didn't even think about it. I was playing the dap within seconds of opening the box!! I didn't have to work it out at all. The cheapest part of the X1 may be the back. I don't think it's metal. Some kind of hard plastic, but with the black cover, it's not anything to worry about. The cover makes it look good too, although the dap itself looks stunning. X1 sound is extremely good on first listen. I'll settle down with it and see how it goes, but in all honesty, it is a great buy. Fiio has done a marvellous job. The Fuze wouldn't stop working though would it, Frans? They are all pretty reliable. Do yourself a favour and sit on it!! The X1 is really worth the money! I'll get more into the sound with more listening later on. You're not aware of the mild roll off up top. Close to the mild settings of the Polaris!! (new revisions)
|
|
solderdude
Administrator
measureutternutter
Posts: 4,882
|
Post by solderdude on Oct 4, 2014 9:34:17 GMT
Dammit !
I did some 'research' on treble roll-off about 25 years ago (when working at Technics) with blind AB- switching. The reason was the 'revolutionary' analog discrete filter that was said to sound fuller.
I build one myself (the schematics were published) and indeed it sounded 'fuller' on direct comparison so wanted to know why. Measurements showed it had a -0.5dB rolloff point at 20kHz (but started earlier, like the X1). I thought that couldn't be it... too small to detect. The Technics players were flat to 20kHz so I decided to add the same roll-off (by adding a 12dB low pass AFTER the Technics) and not bypassing the original low pass. Sure enough the filters couldn't be told apart.
So a mild roll-off (many of the better sounding DACs seem to roll-off early) have this feature and is why I used this in the Polaris. no roll-off and just -0.5 dB down at 20kHz and a similar roll-off to NOS DAC's (-3dB at 20kHz) to add some custom flavour without rolling off the highs (well 20kHz-3dB is audible) The newer Polaris amps will have these settings, the current ones differ too much.
Anyway... back to the X1. The roll-off isn't audible as roll-off but on direct comparison (AB-ing) with a flat FR it seems 'hinted to sound fuller'. VERY VERY subtle and you need good (young) ears and decent speakers/headphones to hear it though.
|
|
Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Oct 4, 2014 10:01:47 GMT
I think you would need good ears to hear it, Frans. It certainly doesn't 'sound' thicker up top, but the dap does have an overall, pretty 'full' sound. I guess that could be the effects of taking the very top down a bit. Just shifts the FR 'tilt' a fraction? It's not like the frequencies are missing, it's just slightly lower in dynamic perhaps, but it's just too subtle to hear plainly in any case.
Earphone listening is very complex anyway. I'm not certain that we always 'know' what is best. For instance, the T40 on an a/b test might come out (Frequency reponse wise) as very bland and just not musical, whereas it is actually pretty flat!!
I don't like headphones that are brittle up top so for instance the brother headphone to the one ASR was using on the Polaris; the 1000, rather than the 2000 to me was absolutely nasty sounding. It had a top that was just like a razor and I couldn't listen for long if I'm honest. Everyone said that the 2000 was a different headphone but following my experience with the 1000, I couldn't face the expense of a 2000. Take that top down a few db though and it could have tilted the headphone enough for me to like its clarity I guess.
It's the fullness of the X1 that I really like a lot and the top doesn't seem thick to me at all. Now if the Polaris is similar, we have a great match here!! I'll soon find out if I put on mid setting I guess. I can't wait to hear it. Problem is that I love the Ember sound so much!!
Were you thinking of lessening the Polaris top slightly less? Say 0.5 db or so? I think the new revision sees it down by what .... 2db? Not a lot in it, but with this subtle drop on the X1, the sound does actually seem pretty full. It didn't occur to me that a dip up top would give an overall impression of 'fullness'. The bass isn't artificially boosted or anything either.
With regards to the headphone/line out socket, there's a switching system in the settings that makes it behave as a line out. You go into settings and then you can get the socket to behave as a true line out. It's even better sounding via line out as well. I put it into the Ember and the sound seems more expansive than from the headphone out. It has a healthy output as well. It really develops bass weight via the Ember actually. The bass itself hits hard but I also listened to a higher resolution file of the album, Touch by YELLO and it goes really deep as well. It positively rumbles. I think the bass is more solid than the Ipods actually.
I'm having a good listen now. The sound is extremely natural and warm. It doesn't sound 'digital' or artificial at all. It also goes lower in volume and stil sounds convincing actually. I can't see why that is, but it is way more natural and satisfying at lower volumes than other players that I hae. It doesn't seem to diminish as much as other devices and the presence remains. The result is that you get a very much 'there' sound with excellent mids but it isn't a forced sound in any way. It simply sounds natural. You don't feel as strong a need to turn up in order to get presence. It's a warm sounding player though, I think. Good bass presence and pretty clean up top. In actual fact, on a good recording, the bass really kicks in and sounds as though it is going low too. It's worth having an amp on it though.
So it looks like a great job has been done on the tailoring of the sound as well. This is quite a player imo. I must admit that I am very curious now about the X5.
|
|
Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Oct 4, 2014 19:28:55 GMT
Just under two minutes to read a 64Gb card. That is way faster than the Fuze. Masses of stuff loaded on now and no more long waits for it to read what's actually on the card.
The sound is more full than an Ipod. It is definitely more focused at lower volumes as well. There is a better sense of presence and it is quite satisfying to listen to at levels I don't normally listen at. It seems much less fussy about listening volumes.
|
|
Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Oct 5, 2014 8:00:56 GMT
I've had a really good go with it now and tried different headphones, so I have more of a grip of what it sounds like.
The sound is warm but not overly bassy. The bass is really robust and goes deeper than Ipods. If you get something that really rumbles, where the Ipod almost 'hints' at it, the Fiio actually plays it quite robustly. So it is going deeper for sure. I suspect that the Ipod are limited in this respect until you go from the dock connector, and then it sounds a good deal better.
Treble is extremely smooth. It's not at all glassy but does extend without emphasis. If Im honest, it doesn't really sound like it's playing an MP3 or wav file. It sounds very natural with a slightly warm bias.
Mids are lovely. Really well balanced sound that feels extremely natural and not 'processed' in any way.
The effect of its balance as far as FR goes gives the Fiio a relaxed but really accurate sound that has more weight than you'd first think. Once you get a good recording with lots of info down there, it really gives this rotund, big hearted bass.
The other thing that seems clear now, is that it focuses better at low volume than the Ipods. The sound gains 'presence' quite early on in the volume scale. Going further makes the music come closer, but the presence is already there at way lower volume. I have no idea why this could be other than the FR is pretty good and so you get a more natural' sound. For instance, if mids are a little low on say, headphones, I tend to turn up until the mids focus. That can then impact on the bass and teble which can become overbearing so you have to back off on the presence a bit to compensate. This seems to snap into focus pretty low down. You get the feeling that the headphone is being driven well, rather than just being up to the job as you sometimes can feel with Ipods. You know, when you get to 80% and you still feel that the music could do with a bit more poke? This works down at 40 - 50% and actually focuses lower. I've been regularly listening around 30 - 35% which is lower than I would normally listen and feel quite satisfied with the presence of the music.
Imaging may be a little narrow. Not exactly sure, since I'm not great at the image thing. There are occasions when I think sounds come from further away from the head though and on other occasions, it feels in the centre and a little close together. However, this could be the recordings.
Going via the line out opens it out even more. I'd say it is improved from the line out actually. Going into the Ember is jaw dropping. It develops serious presence and I also think the imaging improves. Dynamics are stunning; especially on the Ember. If it were possible, I'd put a battery on the Ember and strap the DAP to it!! It develops a really powerful, deep and impactful sound.
It can drive some of the more difficult headphones like the DT250. It does mean that the volume goes up quite a bit, but it does work. The X3 would be better in this respect. The hd598 sounds absolutely excellent coming directly from it. It seems like a good match to me. The bass is slightly warmer and really makes the hd598 shine.
Negatives - the screen could be brighter for outdoor use. In fact it goes brighter, but the contrast needs to be 'upped' so that it is more obvious outside. However, having it lower saves the battery life. Talking about the battery life - it's good. Played it all day yesterday. No problem.
There is no way to make playlists which is a minus for some. Not for me.
There is no search facllity which is a minus once you get a big cards into it. I'm using a spare 64Gb card and even that has a ton of music on it. Looking for something can be slow. I find that a little irritating and hope that Fiio might do a revision.
The other irritation with the menu is that you can search on genres etc which is great, but it doesn't give you albums. It sees 'songs' so for instance if you put in 'rock' it'll come up with a massive list of rock songs rather than rock albums. This is a software thing and could easily be looked at, but searching through 128Gb is no fun so in this case, I think the search facilities are more important than on something with a low memory. The other option of course is to keep a series of 8Gb cards and just swap around.
A simple thing - the case could have been given a slot to access the memory card port more easily. It's a bit of a nuisance to have to rip the case off in order to change the card. A small complaint that is so easily fixed with a minor adjusment to the case.
The card goes in upside down. It catches you out the first time around and the card can get stuck!!
The line out works perfectly but you have to go into the menu system to set it. Although it gives a written warning about headphones being too loud on the screen, it is very easy to forget next time you turn it on and then blow your head off with a massive output.... or worse, blow your IEM. I think that needs to be looked at actually.
So, the interface has a few irritations. It's not bad and looks well thought out, but there are some things that could easily improve it.
Sound is brilliant and I hear the the X3 and X5 are even better. I may well go X5 once the software is sorted finally. I hear there are glitches.
I'm lucky in that I didn't have to pay for this DAP. Would I pay £99 for it. A BIG yes. This is definitely worth its price and in my case, this is definitely going to replace my Ipods. It is superior in sound without a doubt and now I want to look at the X3!!!!!
|
|
Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Oct 9, 2014 19:45:04 GMT
I bought a couple of 128 Gb cards on EBay at £12 each. Into the X11 and a quick format. Result. I now have 256 Gb free and available for it. Unbranded, but class 10 and work fine. It really doesn't seem that fussy about cards at all.
Now I need a load of hi res material to stick on them!!!!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Fiio X1
Oct 9, 2014 21:21:06 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2014 21:21:06 GMT
I've been waiting for this player. How would you say it compares to the Clip+? So far your description of the sound reminds me of my HD 650's.
|
|
Rabbit
Administrator
Posts: 7,087
|
Post by Rabbit on Oct 10, 2014 5:07:43 GMT
I haven't directly compared their sound yet, but it's way more solid in the hand. Build is very good. Display is much better. Interface is not the best but also not bad actually and it works fast. I think an update may be on the way as well, quite soon. (According to James Fiio)
It takes big cards where the Clips don't. The Clip goes to 32Gb officially. I never tried 64 in mine. I'm currently loading up a ridiculously cheap 128Gb card onto the X1. The Clip won't read it. It's taking a long time to get the files on, but I want to see how fast the X1 goes with something this large, fully loaded up. No radio on the X1.
Output is way better on line out setting than the Clip. On headphones, both are very good with the advantages of a wider variety of files on the X1. I really like the sound of the X1. It just doesn't sound digital. Smooth with lots of duty amicus and punch. Some say on HF that the X3 sounds better. If it does, then it's one helluva player. However, they all don't seem to like the X3 interface too much. X5 does better in this respect.
Note from James Fiio:
There are some bugs in interface so update is going to address them. I haven't come across them yet.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Fiio X1
Oct 10, 2014 9:07:50 GMT
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2014 9:07:50 GMT
Thanks for the comparison mate. I know the build quality of the Clip+ isn't that great but then it's 40 quid. I could lose it and not cry, lol. 64GB cards definitely do work in the Clip+ though, at least my Class 10 SanDisk cards do.
The one thing I don't like about small portables is that I can't read their displays without my glasses these days. If I'm going away for a few days I have a less portable, more transportable solution - my Note 3 hooked up to a Fiio E18. That sounds incredible but in reality it's far too large a combination to be considered truly portable.
I'm currently looking for a job but when I find one these Fiio players are going to be on my list, I'm just not sure which one yet.
|
|